controlling corruption

Muhammad A.S. Hikam

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C
Ref Batch Number
2
Country of Reform
Interviewers
Matthew Devlin
Name
Muhammad A.S. Hikam
Interviewee's Position
Senior Adviser
Interviewee's Organization
Kiroyan Kuhon Partners, consultants
Language
English
Nationality of Interviewee
Indonesian
Town/City
Jakarta
Country
Date of Interview
Reform Profile
Yes
Abstract

Muhammad A.S. Hikam describes constitutional and governance reforms and efforts to build a civil society in Indonesia since 1998. A member of the Hanura (People’s Conscience) political party, a former member of the Indonesian Parliament, and a former state minister for research and technology, he explains that prior to Indonesia’s financial crisis in 1988 and the collapse of the Suharto government, civil society in Indonesia was “corporatist”; that is, that except for the Nahdlatul Ulama (Islamic Scholars Awakening) Party, all civil society organizations and political parties were controlled by the state. In 1998, it was recognized that a strengthened civil society was the only avenue to challenge the overwhelming power of the state. The result was a flowering of as many as 100,000 civil society organizations and 38 political parties. However, nearly all came into being without the capacity or understanding to pursue their roles effectively. Many were based on ethnic or identity interests and did not know how to relate to the political life of the country. The challenge was to train civil and political society to find synergies between interests and needs. Without that, governmental reform has been, and will continue to be, a patchwork, he says. He discusses the successes and shortcomings of reforms in four principal areas: changing the constitution to reduce state domination, opening the political process to opposition parties, removing the military from politics and placing civilian control over the police and armed forces, and decentralizing government and ceding some autonomy to the regions. These efforts have proceeded without regard for capacity building, he says. As a result, poorer regions simply establish regional governments funded by the central government without developing their own capabilities. Hikam stresses that economic development is essential if regional autonomy is to work.    

Profile

At the time of this interview, Muhammad A.S. Hikam was a member of the Hanura (Hari Nurani Rakyat or People’s Conscience) political party and a senior adviser to the consulting firm of Kiroyan Kuhon Partners in Jakarta. He first joined the government in 1983 as a researcher with the Indonesian Institute of Sciences. From 1999 to 2001, he was minister for research and technology, and from 2004 to 2007 was a member of Parliament’s House of Representatives. He received his undergraduate education at Gadjah Mada University in 1981 and received master’s degrees in communications and political science and a Ph.D. in political science from the University of Hawaii in 1995.    

Full Audio File Size
83 MB
Full Audio Title
Muhammad A.S. Hikam - Full Interview

Erry Firmansyah

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C
Focus Area(s)
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1
Critical Tasks
Country of Reform
Interviewers
Matthew Devlin
Name
Erry Firmansyah
Interviewee's Position
Former President
Interviewee's Organization
Jakarta Stock Exchange
Language
English
Nationality of Interviewee
Indonesian
Town/City
Jakarta
Country
Date of Interview
Reform Profile
No
Abstract

Erry Firmansyah, former president of the Jakarta Stock Exchange, describes business and public responses to reforms in the Ministry of Finance, Tax Court, Securities and Exchange Commission, and Customs by the government of Indonesia. He says that, though it is not possible to eliminate all bribery or illegal payments, employees in the Ministry of Finance were acting professionally and focusing on making Indonesia’s markets more attractive and liquid for both local and foreign investors and surveillance of illegal financial activities. Taxpayers and businesses find that they are treated much more impartially and fairly as “customers,” he says. It is no longer assumed automatically that everyone is cheating on taxes. When there are disagreements, disputes can be taken to the Tax Court, which gained a reputation for being fair and impartial. He says these changes were the result of a new mindset brought about through a system of performance rewards, incentives and improved compensation of employees to more closely match the private sector. These reforms were reinforced by the Komisi Pemberantasan Korupsi, an agency that can arrest and prosecute both government officials and citizens for corrupt activities. In addition, he says, the budget process was reformed so that vendors and contractors found the system fairer and easier to work with. He says there still was room for improvement in the tax system because many small businesses were not registered and corrupt practices persisted. Some court procedures also needed to be improved, he says. Nonetheless, the country weathered the recent world economic recession fairly well because of these reforms and the increased trust of both local and foreign investors in the country’s improved financial integrity. He expects the reforms will be sustained for the foreseeable future.    

Profile
At the time of this interview, Erry Firmansyah was a private businessman who served as president of the Jakarta Stock Exchange for seven years until June 2008.  With over 20 years of experience in the financial services industry, he served as president director of the Indonesia Stock Exchange (IDX) from 2002. He started his career as an auditor for Drs Hadi Sutanto Office / Correspondent Price Waterhouse (1982-1984) before taking up managerial positions at PT Dwi Staya Utama (1984-1985) and PT Sumarno Prabottinggi Management (1985-1990). He was finance director at PT Lippo Land Development (1990-1991) and senior vice president at Lippo Group (1991-1992) before moving to PT AON Indonesia as director (1992-1997). Before his president director position at IDX, he was president director of Indonesian Central Securities and Depository from 1998 to 2002. He graduated from the University of Indonesia’s Faculty of Economics, majoring in accounting.
Full Audio File Size
26 MB
Full Audio Title
Erry Firmansyah - Full Interview

Juwono Sudarsono

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C
Ref Batch Number
6
Country of Reform
Interviewers
Matthew Devlin
Name
Juwono Sudarsono
Interviewee's Position
Minister of Defense
Interviewee's Organization
Indonesia
Language
English
Nationality of Interviewee
Indonesian
Town/City
Jakarta
Country
Date of Interview
Reform Profile
No
Abstract

Juwono Sudarsono reflects on lessons learned from nation building and governance reform in Indonesia. He states that when he was named minister of defense in 2004 by the president, his instructions were to neutralize the political role of the military and its dominance of the government, to require the military to support national democratization, and to scrutinize the defense acquisition process in order to reduce corruption. He found it was not difficult to convince the military to withdraw from the political process, because the military had come to see its political role as a liability jeopardizing its credibility with the population. The police were removed from military control and placed under separate civilian control. Military-operated businesses were either eliminated or placed under control of a new agency. He says it was more difficult to reduce the number of police-operated businesses because the salaries of members of the police were low, so they inevitably seek ways to make the additional income they needed. He says that corruption cannot be eliminated, but it can be reduced step by step. He describes initiatives to reduce bribes and kickbacks in the defense acquisition process. He points out that the government was starved for revenue because $25 billion a year was being lost to illegal smuggling and organized crime. To advance the process of democratization, the military began to provide training and technical assistance to help build the capacities for democracy and development in other sectors of society. He points out that while there were individuals capable of assuming top positions, the country was very short of capabilities at the second and third levels. The military helped to train accountants, managers, specialized lawyers and other specialists at these levels, particularly in the marginal regions. He believes that while merit systems are essential to build the competence of the civil services, affirmative action needs to be taken to help marginalized people feel that they are part of the national society. This means that merit sometimes should not be the only standard taken into account. Democratization and development depend upon building up a trained middle class, he says.

Profile

At the time of this interview, Juwono Sudarsono was Indonesia's minister of defense, in a term that began in 2004. From 2003 to 2004, he was ambassador to the United Kingdom. From 1999 to 2000 he served as the first civilian minister of defense. He was minister for education and culture in 1998-1999, after serving as minister of state. From 1995 to 1998, he was vice governor of the National Defence College. He received bachelor's and master's degrees from the University of Indonesia, studied at the Institute of Social Studies in The Hague, Netherlands, and received a master's from the University of California at Berkeley. He earned a Ph.D. from the London School of Economics. 

Full Audio File Size
65 MB
Full Audio Title
Minister Juwono Sudarsono - Full Interview

Ramesh Chand Jain

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A
Focus Area(s)
Ref Batch Number
5
Critical Tasks
Country of Reform
Interviewers
Rohan Mukherjee
Name
Ramesh Chand Jain
Interviewee's Position
Deputy Commissioner of Kamrup
Interviewee's Organization
Guwahati, India
Language
English
Nationality of Interviewee
Indian
Town/City
Kamrup, Guwahati
Country
Date of Interview
Reform Profile
No
Abstract

Ramesh Chand (R.C.) Jain, deputy commissioner of Kamrup for Guwahati, India, describes his efforts to revive and reform the Assam State Transport Corp. during his tenure as managing director beginning in the year 2000. At the time he assumed his position, ASTC was on the verge of being closed down after 100 years of existence. It had about 5,400 employees who had not been paid for 14 months, a substantial debt, and only 72 vehicles in operating condition, earnings from which were almost nothing. The employees had been agitating and protesting since 1988. He discusses how he convened meetings of top employees and slowly persuaded them that they would benefit from significant changes. He had political support from the transport minister to undertake reform at any cost. Jain talks about reducing the number of employees through a voluntary retirement plan, requesting voluntary assistance from Tata Motors to train ASTC mechanics and improve repair shops, and starting an innovative public-private partnership by offering ASTC stations to private operators who would use ASTC vehicles and share income. He then convinced the private operators to recruit drivers and conductors from ASTC’s surplus workforce on financial terms favorable to both the operators and ASTC, and started a system under which each vehicle had an owner who was responsible for operating, maintaining and repairing it. He also talks about a zero-based inventory system under which parts were purchased from dealers only when needed. He also negotiated bulk purchases of tires, batteries, lubricants, and fuel, which were then sold to the operators at market rates.  He also discusses other measures taken by the Minister of Transport.

 

Profile
At the time of this interview, Ramesh Chand Jain was deputy commissioner of Kamrup for Guwahati. He was managing director of the Assam State Transportation Corporation from 2000 to 2006. He joined the Assam Civil Service in 1983 and served in various capacities.
Full Audio File Size
36 MB
Full Audio Title
Ramesh Chand (R.C.) Jain - Full Interview